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McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

For those researching family in the three towns area.


Jayjay1
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McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Mon Oct 14, 2013 7:37 am

My ancestors came from Arran.
I'm interested in Robert McMillan (B: 1766) who married Catherine Black (B: 1786). There must still be some family connections at Ardrossan.
Also William McCreadie (B: 18/3/1792) who married Agnes Orr(B: 1794). I presume William McCreadie is the William McReadie mentioned on the list of Ardrossan residents 1837 by Pigot & Co
- SHOPKEEPERS AND TRADERS: McReadie, William, tide and acting coast waiter.
Family history has it that William was a customs officer who lost a leg due to frostbite while waiting for smugglers.
I notice one of the VINTERS on the 1837 list was Robert Orr. Could this be a brother or father or cousin of Agnes Orr?
Last edited by Jayjay1 on Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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sweet caroline
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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Mon Oct 14, 2013 10:12 am

Hi Jayjay1.Have you all the issue for Robert McMillan.See this site.http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.anc ... ughwallis/

1841 Census has William McCreadie c1796 and Agnes c1796 at Glasgow St.He is a Customs Officer as you stated.

SC
“He that has no fools, knaves, nor beggars in his family, was begot by a flash of lightning.” Thomas Fuller

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:46 am

Thanks so much SC. I'm on a new path of discovery.

Cheers, Jayjay1

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Thu Nov 28, 2013 3:37 am

The Statutory Register of Marriages shows James McMillan marrying Jessie McCreadie in 1858 at Ardrossan. James' parents are shown as Robert McMillan and Catherine McMillan, maiden name Black. Looking at the image of the document, the "Black" could easily have been interpreted in the transcription as "Clark". I guess this could explain how all the threads I have followed lead to Robert McMillan with Catherine Clark.... Or is there also a Robert McMillan of the same era with Catherine Clark?
Are there any helpful souls in the Three Towns area who can confirm the Black connection? I have an old family tree and also a diary written by my grandfather Thomas McMillan (James' and Jessie's son), both referring to Catherine Black.
All part of the mystery of family research, isn't it?
It does seem the Arran connection I grew up believing, is actually an Ardrossan connection!
Cheers, Jayjay1

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Thu Nov 28, 2013 12:21 pm

Jayjay,using the IGI i can only find a Robert McMillan and a Catherine Black 12July 1805 Kilbride.That is using the name Robert McMillan ,marriage Scotland,no dates,spouse Catherine.

SC

Edit-I have the McMillan issue in Ardrossan for Robert McMillan and Catherine Clark.Unless you find a marriage of the McMillan/Clark,You will have to find the death records for all the issue and compare.Is Catherine McMillan's death after 1855 ? or Robert's death after 1855? As it is highly unlikely that either could read or write,then they would not have questioned the church records,if they even saw them.Scotlandspeople deaths Ayrshire 1855-2012 have 3 for mother Clark,and 6 for mother Black.If Catherine was born in Bute and married there ,then her name was known.

Edit-Robert Baillie McMillan 27 August 1826 Ardrossan.Father Robert McMillan,Mother Katherine Clarke.If that is yours then this 1861 Census has Robert born W Kilbride,and Catherine Clarke born Ardrossan.

Name: Robert Mcmillan
Age: 70
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1791
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Catherine Mcmillan
Gender: Male
Where born: W Kilbride, Ayrshire
Registration number: 615
Registration District: Stevenston
Civil Parish: Stevenston
County: Ayrshire
Address: No 18
Occupation: Retired Farmer
ED: 4
Household Schedule Number: 38
Line: 11
Roll: CSSCT1861_90
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Mcmillan 70
Catherine Mcmillan 69
Robert B Mc Mcmillan 34

Have you a tree on Ancestry ?
Edit -Who is the issue you are from?

Edit-1836 Landsborough census
McMillan Robert Clerk Cath. John McM. 8, 3 Townhead
McMillan Robert Black Catherine Marian 3, 3 Dockhead St
“He that has no fools, knaves, nor beggars in his family, was begot by a flash of lightning.” Thomas Fuller

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 6:54 am

Hello SC. I'm most grateful for your interest in my quest. Thank you!

I don’t have the date of death of either Robert or Catherine McMillan.
Their marriage date I have of 1805 agrees with yours.

Robert Baillie McMillan is not part of our known history.

The Statutory Marriage register on Scotlandspeople has the register page to view for the marriage of James McMillan and Jessie McCreadie on 15th March, 1858.
James' parents are listed as Robert McMillan, Shipmaster and Catherine McMillan, maiden name Black.
(This indicates the Robert, "retired farmer" in the 1861 Census is a different Robert.)
James was listed as a Shipmaster and as a widower.
James was 36 and Jessie 29.

The old Family tree I have and refer to is 'The Lochranza MacMillans'
Traced and Compiled by the Rev. Somerled MacMillan,
Bard and Historian of the Clan MacMillan

I wonder if you would know whether this is likely to be reliable?

This tree refers to Robert McMillan, Born 1786, as a Master Mariner.
His first marriage was to Christian McBride, with three children:
John B: 1794
(?? Unreadable name on fold) B: 1798
Mary B: 180?
His second marriage in 1805 was to Catherine Black B: 1786
Their children were:
Donald B: 1806
Mary B: 1808
Robert B: 1810
Christian B: 1813
James B: 1819
James married his first wife, Mary Willock B: 1828.
They had one daughter, Mary Willock.
James then married Jessie McCreadie
James and Jessie's children were:
William 1863 – 1939 Married Elizabeth McCreadie
James
Robert
Thomas Orr 1867 – 1964 Married Eva Knight

This younger Robert is not mentioned in any of our family history and I wonder whether he died young.
Thomas Orr McMillan is my grandfather, born at Ardrossan.
He is the one who wrote the memoir referring to his grandmother as Miss Black.

…and no, I don’t have a tree on Ancestry. I want to be sure of its accuracy first.

Best regards, Jayjay1

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:14 am

Jayjay,I am now clear that it is Catherine Black and not Clark.You should refer to the tree you have,but Robert McMillan must be older than 1786 to be fathering in 1794.

Name: Mary Mc Millan
Gender: Female
Christening Date: 04 Aug 1802
Christening Place: , KILBRIDE, BUTE, SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 02 Aug 1802
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: Robert Mc Millan
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Christiana Mc Bride
-----------------------
Name: Alexander Mc Millan
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 05 Feb 1800
Christening Place: , KILBRIDE, BUTE, SCOTLAND
Birth Date: 02 Feb 1800
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: Robeart Mc Millan
Father's Birthplace:
Father's Age:
Mother's Name: Christiana
--------------------
Name: John Mc Millan
Gender: Male
Christening Date: 16 Nov 1794
Christening Place: , KILBRIDE, BUTE, SCOTLAND
Birth Date:
Birthplace:
Death Date:
Name Note:
Race:
Father's Name: Robert Mc Millan

SC

Edit-Can't help with Lochranza,no early records on the IGI
Lochranza
C115561 1855-1867 M115561 1855-1875
C115563 1868-1875

Edit-see Genuki-Lochranza records come under Kilbride or Kilmory
Edit-https://archive.org/search.php?query=He ... mes%20King
----------------------
Somerled MacMillan relates that there is a family story about a James who was disinherited by the clan because he fought against the British during the American Revolutionary War. This James had first been thought to be a grandson of Alexander MacMillan (4th of New Dunmor Line, 25th Chief of clan MacMillan) according to handed down tradition. But, upon investigation, Somerled is of the belief that the James in question is the grand-nephew and not the grandson since Alexander had died in 1770, six years before the American Revolutionary war had officially started. It is believed that the James in question is James McMillen (b.1764), son of Neil McMillen who fled Scotland in 1746 after the battle of Culloden. At the age of 15, James McMillen enlisted in Captain John Schenck's Company, Colonel Asher Holmes' New Jersey Regiment 1779, re-enlisting to the year 1783. Records tell us that James was out on scouting parties when the war came to an end. Tradition tells us that James McMillen and his family were disowned/disinherited by the Hierarchy of Clan MacMillan in Scotland..
--------------------------
17th century

Macmillan of Knap was considered chief of the clan and when the line became extinct in 1665, the title passed to the Dunmore branch, and from them to the Lagalgarve branch in which it is still vested. There is however some confusion as to whether the Knapdale bloodline is actually extinct due to records of MacMillans being destroyed after the Jacobite Rising from 1685 to the end with The Battle of Culloden on April 16th 1746. There is a dark period of time in Scottish history where Jacobite Clans were banished from Scotland and their family records destroyed. Therefore it is unknown if The Old Dunmore Line is extinct or just dormant
------------------------------
https://archive.org/search.php?query=Clan%20McMillan
“He that has no fools, knaves, nor beggars in his family, was begot by a flash of lightning.” Thomas Fuller

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Fri Nov 29, 2013 9:18 pm

Thank you, SC, for setting me back on course. I now feel confident that the information I have can be relied upon, and that I can discount the question of Catherine Clark.

You’re right, of course, re the date of birth of Robert. The indistinct lettering looks like 1786 and I presumed Robert would be about the same age as Catherine. NEVER PRESUME ANYTHING! You would know I should have looked at other connections and I now realize his younger siblings are John (1772) and Archibald (1773). Looking again, it may be 1766 and as his parents John and Mary Taylor married in 1765, it probably is 1766. I have a long way to go with my research skills, don’t I?

I finally discovered the death record of my great uncle Robert. He was only one when he died, which explains the omission from my grandfather’s memoir as Robert died the year my grandfather was born.

And thank you, SC, for the historic background accounts. Fascinating!

Best regards, Jayjay!

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by Jayjay1 » Sat Jan 04, 2014 12:15 am

Hello S.C., and a very happy 2014 to you and all at Threetowners.

I have Agnes Orr’s marriage to William McCreadie on 4th April 1815 at Saltcoats.
Ref: Scotlands People OPR Marriages and Banns copied from a memorandum on 20th April 1853
This document included the births of their children.
Margaret born 5th March, 1816
Agnes born 16th April 1820
Martha born 14th June, 1822
James born 26th July 1824
Janet born 18th October 1828
Thomas Orr born 30th March 1831
Elizabeth born 25th October 1837
1851 Census has William Mccreadie B: 1793 Irvine
Agnes B: Saltcoats
Jessie B: Ardrossan.
I have found Agnes Orr Born: Kirkoswald 23/12/1794 Baptised: 4/1/1795 Father: William Orr
This 1794 date fits with the family history.
Is this the correct Agnes Orr, because Agnes Orr appears to be a fairly common name at that time?

Best regards, Jayjay.

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Sat Jan 04, 2014 4:12 pm

Happy New Year Jayjay1.It seems Agnes died before 1855 civil records.My guess is her parents were .

spouse: Margaret Malcolm

Name Thomas Orr
Birth Date
Birthplace
Age
Spouse's Name Margaret Malcolm
Spouse's Birth Date
Spouse's Birthplace
Spouse's Age
Event Date 20 Jul 1778
Event Place Ardrossan,Ayr,Scotland
-------------------------
father: Thomas Orr
mother: Margaret Malcom

Name Agnes Orr
Gender Female
Christening Date 17 Aug 1786
Christening Place , ARDROSSAN, AYR, SCOTLAND
Birth Date 15 Aug 1786

10yrs out is within the limits.First dau.named after wifes mother .Thomas Orr speaks for itself.Best i can do without proof.
Also Bride usually married in home town where possible.Also if William McCreadie was born Irvine as the Census states ,then he married away from home .Educated guesses are allowed by professional genealogist.

SC
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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Sat Jan 04, 2014 4:37 pm

Trying to Follow MArgaret McCreadie 1816 Ardrossan.
spouse: Robert Dickie

Name Robert Dickie
Birth Date
Birthplace
Age
Spouse's Name Margaret Mccready
Spouse's Birth Date
Spouse's Birthplace
Spouse's Age
Event Date 12 Jun 1838
Event Place Dundonald,Ayr,Scotland
-------------------
1841
Name: Margaret Dickie
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Gender: Female
Where born: Ayrshire, Scotland

Civil Parish: Ardrossan
County: Ayrshire
Address: Ardrossan Glasgow St
Parish Number: 576
Household Members: Name Age
Margaret Dickie 25
Agness Dickie 2
Janet MacCreadie 12 -c1829
-------------------
1851

Name: Margaret Dickie
Age: 34
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1817 -Edit-The 1851 Census from Scotlandspeople may say wither she is widowed or not?
Relationship: Sister-in-law
Gender: Female
Where born: Ardrossan, Ayrshire
Parish Number: 644/2
Civil Parish: Govan
Town: Glasgow-Tradeston
County: Lanarkshire
Address: 4 St James St

John Dickie c 1819 Riccarton-Provision Merchant
Wife -Agnes Dickie c1821 Ardrossan
Son -William M C c 1847 Govan
-----------------------
Edit-
Married
spouse: John Dickie

Name John Dickie
Birth Date
Birthplace
Age
Spouse's Name Agnes Mccready
Spouse's Birth Date
Spouse's Birthplace
Spouse's Age
Event Date 04 Nov 1845
Event Place Govan,Lanark,Scotland
----------------

Father's Name John Dickie
spouse: Agnes Orr Mc Creadie
child: Agnes Mc Creadie Dickie

Name Agnes Mc Creadie Dickie
Gender Female
Christening Date
Christening Place
Birth Date 05 Feb 1855
Birthplace TRADESTON,GLASGOW,LANARK,SCOTLAND
-----------------------------
I,ve lost Margaret Dickie nee McCreadie.Wonder if she remarried? or emigrated?
“He that has no fools, knaves, nor beggars in his family, was begot by a flash of lightning.” Thomas Fuller

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Re: McMillan, Black, McCreadie, Orr families.

Post by sweet caroline » Sat Jan 04, 2014 5:38 pm

Is this the same William McCreadie that goes on to marry a
Eliza Mccreadie
Age: 57
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1804
Relationship: Wife
Spouse's name : William Mccreadie
Gender: Female
Where born: England

Name: William Mccreadie
Age: 69
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1792
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Eliza Mccreadie
Gender: Male
Where born: Irvine, Ayrshire
Registration number: 576/2
Registration District: New Ardrossan
Civil Parish: Ardrossan
Town: Ardrossan
County: Ayrshire
Address: 66 Glasgow St
Occupation: Retird Landing Warter Custon
Mary Dickeie 19 -c1942 Ardrossan-Grandaughter
Margaret Dickere 15 -c1846 Ardrossan -Grandaughter-been here before :D

1841
Name: William Mccreadie
Age: 45
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1796
Gender: Male
Where born: Ayrshire, Scotland

Civil Parish: Ardrossan
County: Ayrshire
Address: Ardrossan Glasgow St
Occupation: Customs Officer
Parish Number: 576
Household Members: Name Age
William Mccreadie 45
Agness Mccreadie 45
“He that has no fools, knaves, nor beggars in his family, was begot by a flash of lightning.” Thomas Fuller

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